[00:01] Justin McCullough - What do you do when it's your turn to lead? Well, that's a great question. The Vision, Values and Velocity podcast is all about a better way of thinking.

[00:09] Justin McCullough - And how to get you where you.

[00:10] Justin McCullough - Are now to where you want to be as quickly, confdently and intentionally as possible so you can make an impact at work, home and life. Hello, this is Justin McCullough. Thanks for joining my show. You know, my goal here is to give you the encouragement, clarity and confdence to tackle whatever your next big thing is, whether that's leading a team or running a business or taking on that big new project. And I'm certain stories like these are going to help you on your journey. I'd love for you to take a listen to this episode where we talk to Ramon Ray, who's entrepreneur, speaker, author and founder of Smart Hustle magazine. Some great insights here. So I hope you listen, maybe take some notes and I'll see you on the other side of the interview.

[00:55] Justin McCullough - We're at the Small Business Festival and I've got Ramon here with us. Why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself and your business.

[01:00] Ramon Ray - Thanks, Justin. I'm Ramone Ray and I'm an entrepreneur frst and foremost. Means I love to do things that are a bit risky and make mistakes and get punched in the face and fail a bit. But I've started a few companies, sold one, my current company that I love my baby that I love the most is Smart Hustle magazine. But I'm a speaker, a writer, entrepreneur, bestselling author.

[01:18] Justin McCullough - Cool.

[01:19] Justin McCullough - So what's the one thing you'd want to kind of latch onto and talk to this audience about? They're all entrepreneurs, just like yourself.

[01:24] Ramon Ray - A lot of things I could talk about, Justin. I think the frst thing probably is the aspect of entrepreneurial depression, which is loneliness. I think that people see the large companies, billion dollar companies of the world, Ubers and Face, and I think it's glamorized a bit. But as an entrepreneur who started several companies, I think we forget that it's lonely. You make mistakes. What do you tell, in my case, your wife, what do you tell your kids? What do you tell your friends? You're on this pedestal. People don't know. It's not the case today that you're a dollar away from not being able to pay your rent. So I think that aspect of that, it's glamorized, the world glamorizes it. But the reality is you have to get a line of credit, you have to get money, you have to get fnancing.

[01:59] Ramon Ray - It's tough sometimes, man.

[02:00] Justin McCullough - Yeah.

[02:01] Ramon Ray - I have indeed. I mean, one, I used to work at the United nations for a number of years until I was fred or resigned. No, I was fred. No, can't remember which one it was. It was one of the two. Justin.

[02:09] Justin McCullough - Freed up for new opportunities.

[02:10] Ramon Ray - Freed up for new opportunities.

[02:11] Justin McCullough - Yes.

[02:11] Ramon Ray - I like that. And I left there with just a few dollars in the bank. And, you know, my wife would tell me every month, hey, Ramon, we have X amount. X amount. X amount. So I know that stress, what it's like. I've done things, Justin, where I've blown. And for me, this is a lot. For Some, it's not $50,000 on an event. I do events that I thought I could rock in San Francisco. It failed. I mean, I had to, honey, I lost. You lost what?

[02:37] Justin McCullough - Right, right.

[02:37] Ramon Ray - So, yeah, I've been there, and I still make mistakes. Thankfully, they're not as big as earlier in my career. You know what I mean? But I think entrepreneurship is a bit about discovery, a bit about trying. Like a good cook. Right. If a good cook doesn't burn something or whatever, I'm not sure. Just you can tell whatever the good cooks do, then you're not cooking strong enough, if it makes sense.

[02:55] Justin McCullough - Yeah, absolutely. So when you have an experience like that, a $50,000 mistake, right. You know, and you're trying to manage those distinctive opportunities to figure out what you want to do next. Right. You know, how do you pull the finances together? How do you get it back together and say, I still can do this?

[03:16] Ramon Ray - I think a few things are important. I think, one, you have to learn from the mistakes. I think that's very important. If you're not able to learn from your mistakes, not able to innovate, learning is one. A big thing that I found, Justin, is mentorship. And I think there's different kinds of mentors. There's mentors, people who are. I call them professional mentors, meaning you're in the banking industry. So have I gone to my bank or my person who I can talk to about money openly, you know, and talk to them, or a lawyer, accountant, people like that. But then there's just people who are smart people, probably other entrepreneurs who can put their arm around you and say it's okay and give you some steps to do it.

[03:47] Ramon Ray - And I think the third thing are those people who may not be entrepreneurial, but everybody needs a friend, a hug. And, you know, I'll tear up if I keep talking too long. So I don't want to keep talking about this because I'll start crying. No, I'm just teasing. But it is very touchy. It is a very tough subject for me because I deal with it a lot. And the other thing is, I think doubt or self doubt, however you want to word that means just thinking I'm not good enough. I can't do it. I suffer with that. I just, as you know, came off the stage before I went there.

[04:10] Justin McCullough - Yeah.

[04:10] Ramon Ray - I was nervous thinking, man, it's livestream. Oh, my God. I can't say rewind.

[04:15] Justin McCullough - Right, Right. Yeah, absolutely. You know what I just heard, there was something really, I think, compelling and it deserves to be repeated. Mistakes happen. Sometimes $50,000 mistakes happen. Right. And resources are people in the public that you can trust, whether they're an accountant or financial manager or somebody like that. Right. There are also people in the business. Right. Other small business owners that have succeeded and professional mentors. And so that's a good way to sort of touch on. You're never really alone. It's a choice to be alone, right?

[04:44] Ramon Ray - Correct.

[04:44] Justin McCullough - Correct.

[04:44] Ramon Ray - That's important.

[04:45] Justin McCullough - And so for those folks that are maybe not where they want to be, like in your case, high energy, super successful, you've done a lot of wonderful things. You're on the stage, you're telling people about what success looks like, right?

[04:55] Ramon Ray - Correct.

[04:56] Justin McCullough - Wonderful picture you're painting. What about those that are just saying, like, what's the paint by numbers, man. Like, I haven't mastered the paintbrush yet and I believe what you're showing. How do we get there?

[05:05] Ramon Ray - I don't want to be trivial on this. I'm going to say a few things, but I think hard work, and there's a few other things beyond hard work, because you can be hard working and be doing it stupidly, you know, doing it the wrong way. Pointed where? Where's California? West. Right. You can be pointed east and trying to work your way hard. And going east, you're not going to get to California. You got to go west. California is Western.

[05:22] Justin McCullough - Yeah, go Western, man.

[05:23] Ramon Ray - Okay, good. So I think harder work is one I've had young people, I mentor young people. And, you know, people have said, oh, I want to be where Ramon is at. And by the way, Justin, I have a long way to go. But thank you. I am successful. I'm blessed to be that. But just so you know, I have a long way to go and I live a very simple life, just to be clear on this. But I want to be. Ramon has this laptop computer and he makes money. Well, Ramon's been doing this a 25 year journey. So I put the work in, I've made the mistakes, I've screwed up to earn in a humble way to earn that right to be where I am today.

[05:53] Ramon Ray - So I think that's one many people are not willing to do the hard work to do it. I've had my leg busted and still went to Javits center in New York to do interviews with my camera and a crutches. So I'll hustle anybody. Maybe not you, but I'll hustle anyway. I think two going to the mentorship, Justin, to be smart about it, as you know you help people, is that you have to be able to be smart about it. But I think if you're not smart about it's not going to work. And I think the third thing is that the attitude you have, everybody is not cut out to be an entrepreneur. And that's not a bad or good thing. This has been glamorized entrepreneurship. Some people are amazing rock stars in a function, maybe working for someone else.

[06:32] Ramon Ray - So before you become an entrepreneur, if you get scared at the sight of blood, think twice.

[06:38] Justin McCullough - Right? Right. Well, you know, I think that a lot of times folks miss the fact that the journey to success is what empowers you to be a mentor, to contribute back to those who are on the same journey. Right. So you've done it now, you've made it to a measure of success through those failures, through those challenges. And now you're talking about how important it is to have a mentor and to give back. And what I saw on the stage was somebody who was passionate about giving back. Right. And that passion radiates through you. Right. In everything that you do. So what happens for the folks that maybe don't identify with that level of passion or that level of physical energy? Right. There's a ton of energy here. Right. What do you tell those folks?

[07:12] Ramon Ray - Yeah, I think a few things. I think one, you can only be yourself. I can't be you, Justin. You can't be me. And I think that's really important. To be clear, some of my mentors are Seth Godin. Love the guy to death. He's a distant mentor of mine. You know, I read his books, we have discussions on occasion. Or Gary Vaynerchuk, others like this Damon John, whoever it is. But I had to realize, Justin, at one point, I can't be them and I can emulate, I can steal some of their ideas and things, but I need to be me. So I think that's One thing, those of you who are watching this video, those of you who are out there, I think, to understand, be yourself. I think that's one.

[07:46] Ramon Ray - I think point two is that oftentimes it's the fear of starting or the fear of failure that stop people from starting. Justin. So my biggest tip is that I can't help you, meaning in the proverbial sense, if you're not at least willing to get into the pool, I can't teach you how to swim. So I think that's the second thing I would say. At least start somewhere if you're scared of the water. In our example here, just put your legs over the side of the edge. Just start there. That's what I would say.

[08:12] Justin McCullough - That's wonderful. Yeah. So Seth Godin, Idea Virus, Permission Marketing, Purple Cow, Tribes, Lynchpin.

[08:19] Ramon Ray - Have you read those books, too?

[08:19] Justin McCullough - Yeah, yeah, I'm familiar with them. So what I saw, though, on stage just a while ago was really the Cliff Notes of success that come out of those books, right? And ship it and be a deliverer and tell stories. Right. I mean, you're preaching from Seth's playbook, right? So let's get a little tactical, right? How can these entrepreneurs, a little bit around what you talked about today, tell great stories, create compelling evidence that they deserve attention? Tell us a little bit about that.

[08:44] Ramon Ray - That's a great point. I was at an event with Jillian Michaels. I call her the ab lady, but, you know, the exercise lady, et cetera. And she said one thing is do quality work. So I think that's one thing, practically do good work. I'm not good in finances, not good in numbers, not good in economics. I'm not very strategic. I have a lot of issues. But I must say I've been blessed with the talent to speak, as people have said. As you've said, that's just something I can own. At least I try to do it the best I can. I learn, I hone my craft. I read books, I watch others. So I think do good work is, I think, point two with marketing. How can you build your brand? How can you start to get attention? Video's a great way, Justin.

[09:21] Ramon Ray - We all have video, you know, videos on our phones, et cetera. Take that phone. Hey, this is Justin. This is Ramon. You know, three tips with how you can be more financially savvy. Do that every other day. Do that once a week. Video is important. You'll grow, I think. Point three. Thank you, Mark Zuckerberg and everybody else who gave us Twitter and Facebook and et cetera. Use these tools? I think so. Those are three things I would say between video, social media, between doing good. The fourth thing I'd say another thing, Justin, is many business owners, I don't think they take the time to get their existing customers to come back to them again. Justin's already bought two orange sweaters from me. Hey, Justin, did you like it? Yes. Do you know the people who could do it? Yes.

[10:01] Ramon Ray - Could you refer business to me? He's going to want to do it.

[10:03] Justin McCullough - Sure. That's right.

[10:04] Justin McCullough - Yeah.

[10:04] Justin McCullough - When we talk about the avatar, the ideal customer.

[10:06] Justin McCullough - Right.

[10:06] Justin McCullough - And those re engagement opportunities, let's unpack that. How do you actually do that in your business? How do you create those re engagement opportunities with new value to bring them along the journey with you so that they continue to be a one of your best customers?

[10:18] Ramon Ray - Great point. So I think using the example of the small business festival, I think one is. So I met the producer of Matthew interviewed him at south by Southwest. He said, ramon, can you come and speak at my event? I said, yes. There's nothing changing hands or anything, but it's him adding value to my world. I'm adding value to his world. We're going to both add value to each other and rise together. So practically it is speaking. So for my living, I work with big brands and help them reach small businesses. I am very grateful and thankful. There's a lot of people who do what I can do. Dime a dozen people can call. I send thank you cards, I send little gifts and things of that nature to help, to say thank you, to add value.

[10:53] Ramon Ray - So I think the small business owners be grateful. I think that's a big thing. People are not grateful enough and think, oh, I'm entitled for you to come to my tire shop and buy tires. No, no. They can go anywhere. You should have a level of gratefulness.

[11:07] Justin McCullough - So as we start to wrap up, one of the things that's on my mind is, you know, from the accountant to the boutique owner to the salon person to the person that's running a marketing business, they all have a different perspective. You talked a little bit about personal brand. Let's close this out with a tip about how people can have a dynamic personal brand regardless of where they are in their business.

[11:27] Ramon Ray - Personal branding is my favorite. So personal corporate branding, to a degree. The branding snobs may disagree. You guys out there, so take it easy. But your logo, your business card, customer service as well, things that you guys are doing as well, that's part of the brand. Everybody knows Capital One. So that part of the brand. But I think where the small business has the edge is that we can stand on our own name. Ramon Ray. So how to do it? You're the salon owner. Maybe every time somebody comes in, you're baking fresh cookies. Maybe when they come in, you're interviewing your customers about their day and showcasing their hair within the video. Maybe when you walk around town, you donate your time and do the hair of people who couldn't afford your services.

[12:07] Ramon Ray - Over time, Justin, your personal brand, you're going to be known as the hair lady. As an example, people call me the hair. Well, they don't, but as the hair lady. And your personal brand will grow, if that makes sense. It's about you, what you can do. And as your personal brand grows, then your corporate brand will grow.

[12:21] Justin McCullough - That's great. So I just want to really close this out. You talked about some books and I shared a couple titles from Seth Godin. That's a great read. You also talked about the value of trusting others with feedback, mentors and others. And to not be lonely, right? To not follow the trap of depression, to accept failure, that it happens. $50,000 mistakes and you can still be successful and still be married too. That's right. That's right. That's exactly right. Well, thank you so much. This is Justin McCullough and I am here at the Small Business Fest. Thank you, Raymond. Thank you very much. Where can people fnd out about you?

[12:52] Ramon Ray - SmartHustle.com that's the best place.

[12:54] Justin McCullough - Thank you. Thank you, Ramon, for bringing such great insights into a really short interview. One of the things that fascinates me with his story is, you know, he really has actually gone from failure to failure, startup to startup and then ultimately success to success. And you know, humble, articulate, considerate. One of the things that is repeatedly, you know, connecting his storylines, it's just connecting with others, bringing value, being grateful, being thankful and recognizing that the journey is hard and that you need mentors and relationships and connections with others to get where you need to go and that really resonates with what vision, values and velocity is all about. So thank you, Ramon for sharing some of those stories.

[13:47] Justin McCullough - I really want to call out his conversation around soft mentors through professional contacts, mentors through book reading and being inspired by them and ultimately still being yourself. Being inspired by, you know, an author or speaker or another entrepreneur is fne, but you still have to be you. And what is exciting about that though is a lot of folks that I've talked to have said you Know what? I've never had a mentor before and I don't know what that's like.

[14:34] Justin McCullough - And I think Ramon, you know, signaled that reading books like Seth Godin's books, one of my favorite authors as well, is a great starting point to being mentored. And of course it's somewhat of a one way direction whenever you're reading books, but it does help sort of package things in a way from a singular voice that helps you understand what's going on.

[15:22] Justin McCullough - And ultimately, most of all of our success in building businesses and doing great work is being able to get up and persevere when we've had really big challenges. And so anyway, thank you so much, Ramon, for the time and the interview and thank you for Matthew Pollard for the Small Business Festival and being able to use that audio. And thanks to Breakmaster Cylinder for the podcast theme music that you hear. And if you'd like to learn more about me, you can fnd me on Twitter MCC Justin and of course go to visionvaluesvelocity.com thanks so much. Until the next one, take care.